Speaker 1 00:00:03 Feel free to share your enthusiasm with anybody you want, but I can tell you that there are gonna be some people who are gonna reign on your parade and they might be your family members From money fit by DRS. It's the fit show, your weekly podcast about real difficult money stories, overcoming financial obstacles and tips for building healthy money habits Today on the money fit show, we're talking with our guest who used education and alternative investment opportunities to rebuild his finances after divorce, and eventually ended up better off than before. I'm your host Todd Christensen
Speaker 2 00:00:48 Car seize the day. Boys make your extraordinary.
Speaker 1 00:01:04 Chris Ogar was a conventional investor who experienced an illiquidity event in 2009 and lost 55% of his, uh, his assets after reading rich dad, poor dad. He began investing in real, uh, real assets, mostly insulated from the ball volatility and taxation of the stock market. That's alternative investments. In nine short years, he recouped his 55% loss and multiplied it many times over. So Chris is now an alternative investment blogger and educator and shares his experience and knowledge with you at the prolific investor do at Chris. Ogar welcome to the money fit show. Hey Todd, thanks for having me on. I really appreciate it. I, uh, have been, I've looking forward this since we, uh, first connected, uh, just a few just actually just a few days ago. Uh, and, uh, cuz it, cuz I have an interest in, in real estate myself, but well, what I want I'm looking forward to talking to you about is kind of that journey, how you got there and how discovered that and, and where you were before.
Speaker 1 00:02:09 But um, if you're ready for my first question though, is kind of the question I ask everybody. How did you, did you always think you'd end up, um, as an author you're cuz you're an author now, right? I am as of, uh, November of last year, uh, I'm an author and um, uh, I've always liked writing. I don't think I ever, uh, I've got a binder of letters to the editor that I've written over the years. So I like to write and I like to educate and teach and that's always kind of, not for the most part, not something I ever did professionally, but just kind of, I know it's just part of my DNA, but I, I did, uh, well, I take that back, you know, it was probably about 20 years ago when I was looking to be published in the traditional way.
Speaker 1 00:02:50 And I wrote some book proposals that was way before Amazon and that all went nowhere. I still have that draft sitting on it on my shelf. I looked at it now and I go, man, what a POS? That was <laugh> great work of, of, of uh, perfection and genius eventually. So I it's kinda something I want to do. Right. Uh, but uh, I, yeah, I don't know that I ever visioned myself actually doing it. I think when you and I were talking earlier, I, I kinda laughed because I don't know about a bit my, my English teachers from high school and, and even more so from college would just kind of be head scratchers knowing that I had published a book. Yep. But um, well I have two, two stories about that when I was in third grade, my, my teacher, miss Mrs. Atkinson. I got in trouble at school that day and Uhhuh, she said, I'm calling your dad at home.
Speaker 1 00:03:39 What time does he get off work? And I said six o'clock and man, I still remember phone rang at six o'clock and my dad answered the phone and he didn't tell me at that time, but he told me later, she told me you would never graduate from high school. <laugh> oh, wow. Wow. Oh, and then the other, the other story is you tell about writing. Uh, I was working for a company at the time, they lot of, uh, off hour classes. And so I took one by a retired school teacher named Susie ball. And it was like everything you wanted to know about grammar and punctuation mm-hmm <affirmative> um, and, and everything you wanna know, but you, I can't remember. But anyway, she, she handed out a piece of paper and she said, anybody who can correctly punctuate this whole thing can leave afterwards and you'll get credit for the craft and sub class.
Speaker 1 00:04:23 And everybody did it and not a person amongst us. Got it. Right. You know, all, all co college graduates in our mid twenties, you know? So <laugh> how do you use a semicolon <laugh> okay. Right. Uh, well, Chris, I, I, uh, I was interested in your story that you have, uh, have shared. Um, and because this was, this was now 13 years ago, you went through a couple of different, I think a couple of different challenges that, uh, had effect on your finances. Um, I think one was one was one divorce. And then you, did you lose your job or did you just say goodbye to your job? I said, oh, I said goodbye. <laugh> yeah. OK. Yeah. So the sequence events was the divorce, which is what caused the 55% loss and assets and thousands of dollars a month. Um, so, you know, and that was in my mid forties mm-hmm <affirmative> like, like, uh, many Americans, I was a conventional investor on, on now what I like to call the hot, the 401k highway to mediocrity.
Speaker 1 00:05:32 So just, uh, and, and that, that plan was working about as well as it does for anyone. Then it got dramatically worse when I lost 55% of my assets. So that was okay, what am I gonna do in, in my mid forties? Uh, so that I don't have to have to work forever. Right. Right. I, you know, divorce, I've worked with a lot of clients over the years and, and talked a lot of people in my courses that, uh, that some people are, are surprised. A lot of people are surprised that divorce is, is number three, or excuse me, number four on the list of top reasons people file for, for bankruptcy. Yep. I mean, uh, why do you, I mean, okay, so the divorce decree is there and, and it, you divide up household, right. There are other expenses involved in, in, in divorce that, uh, can, can put it kinda stunt your financial growth too.
Speaker 1 00:06:27 Yeah. Well, it depends on, um, it depends on the state and the length of the marriage, but in my case it was the, you know, the, you know, it was the triple whammy, you know, dividing the assets, child support and alimony mm-hmm <affirmative> so, uh, yeah, it was, uh, and there, you know, there, and then there's yeah. There's and then there's, there's, you know, that's just the financial part of it. There's the whole, the whole emotional thing. Uh, you know, some people, you know, get into alcohol or substances and depression and counseling and, uh, you know, in the, in the blink of an eye, you know, one day I was living in my really nice house in the suburbs with my wife and two children. And the next day, you know, I got in my 92, 50 92 F150 pickup truck and made two trips to what I call the down by the river apartment.
Speaker 1 00:07:16 If you ever saw the SNL Chris Farley's skit. So I mean, everything in my life changed, oh, sorry. I, I don't mean to chuckle with that, but <laugh> no, it's, it's, it's a funny reference. So, you know, every, and you know, in, in the course of 24 hours, you know, I was in a completely different and environment physically, uh, emotionally and, and financially, and I've unfortunately, no way too many, uh, mostly men who have gone through that. Mm-hmm <affirmative> and on the, uh, on the financial aspect, unfortunately, most of the, most of them go, okay, well, I mean, there's, there's a couple ways you get over there, you gotta figure out how to make more money, how to invest more money, uh, or you go, well, I will either work or reduce the lifestyle that I plan to have. And unfortunately, most men go, well, I will just work longer and, and live like a popper mm-hmm <affirmative>.
Speaker 1 00:08:08 Uh, and that was not, uh, the way I wanted to do it. I mean, I think in, in most the way most people, it, they might see that as the path of least resistance it's, you know, I'm a already in my job, I'll just work a little longer rather than trying to start something new or, well, I think it seems, I think it's just seems impossible. Mm-hmm <affirmative>, if you, if you, you know, in whatever age, in my case, mid forties, you lose 55% of everything you go, that's gonna be impossible to make that up. And mm-hmm <affirmative> and end up back where I was, you know, in any reasonable amount, amount of time. And, uh, I think it just seems like, you know, uh, a hill too, you know, too high to climb. Yeah. That would, I mean, it, uh, divorce is just, is just hard all around.
Speaker 1 00:08:55 All parties are, are, are struggling with that. So I, um, I appreciate you sharing that. Um, so how, where did you go? You, you you're, you've divorced, your, your assets are gone, your, uh, are, are, are greatly diminished. Your monthly, um, income is now split instead of between one household now between two households. Right. And, uh, what, what were your options? What did you, what did you want to go from there? What, what were you thinking that, uh, you could, uh, give, uh, might attempt? Well, luckily, uh, you know, I had a good job and, and believe it or not, I was able to, you know, I was able to take on that burden. Um, and, and, and I was able to support the two households. Uh mm-hmm <affirmative> uh <laugh> and, and I would say I was able to do the, you know, the normal things.
Speaker 1 00:09:52 Uh, I didn't have an extravagant lifestyle whatsoever. And I, and I can't say that I sat down with a piece of paper and said, okay, let me, I'm gonna, I'm gonna, I'm gonna give myself nine years and I'm gonna work my way out of this. Uh, it just didn't work that way. Um, I was, um, a friend, a friend of mine, coincidentally had, had suggest I get a book and bought the book and, and like a lot of books that I get, I put 'em, I stack 'em on a shelf until it's time to start reading them cuz the piles getting too high. And anyway, and, and one day I read that book and it was Robert Kiyosaki's rich dad, poor dad, and like millions of other people inter introduced me to this other way of thinking about money and investing and investing in things outside the stock market.
Speaker 1 00:10:37 And I was just really, um, I guess I'm either naive or very open-minded person. My girlfriend always says, you know, you're, you're such a sucker, any salesman, you know, gets you. So there's a, there's a good side and bad side about that. But I typically, you know, I, I kind of take everything at, at face value and, and, and don't really shy away from anything that sounds like it might be too good to be true. And you know, when somebody says, well, you can get returns of 20 to 30% and up tax free and real estate, a lot of people would go, come on <laugh> and they would just move on back to the stock market where the average investor gets about 5% before taxes and inflation that's. Yeah. And so I read that book and then I was in my van by the river apartment and on the radio came an aver, uh, an advertisement for a free seminar being a advertised for Robert Kiyosaki's organization.
Speaker 1 00:11:28 And so I said, well, I'm going to that you knows, I don't remember whether I called or was online, but you know, I signed up and then a couple weeks later, the time came to, to go to that. And it was probably 30 miles from where I was living at the time. And uh, I went out in the morning to do an errand or something and uh, uh, went to start that 92 F150 pickup truck and it was dead. Oh, it wouldn't start didn't, you know, get to that, uh, that game changer. Exactly. And, uh, luckily I had enough, I didn't have enough time to troubleshoot it and change the battery or starter, which I was capable of doing on a car that age. But, uh, I had enough time. I called around and found a rental car company that would drop off a car at my house.
Speaker 1 00:12:11 And you know, and I got to that free seminar and that was the free seminar that laid to the paid one and the next paid one. And, and really the beginning of all the financial education, whether it be through Robert Kiosaki or many other people that, that it, that it takes to invest in alternative assets, cuz it's not like it's not like a 401k where you, you sign up with an employer these days and you're automatically enrolled and they automatically pick them out of your money. That's gonna go to the 401k and they automatically pick the select, uh, the mix of investments. Mm-hmm <affirmative>, it doesn't work that way. You have to be, you have to be smarter. And uh, so that was kind of how that the fire that, that kind of got me going. So you're you get this book and you start reading, it sounds like you're a reader.
Speaker 1 00:13:01 So you got lots of books, not every book is going to, you know, strike a chord with you. So take, take me back. You're you're in your, you say van by the river, the down by the river, down, down the you're, I mean, look around your, your life at the time. What is it that, that is going on that you, you read this book and you say, yes, I, I want to make this change or this is what I want to do. What, what was it about, uh, what was going on at that time? That, that was so, um, that was, it was just the right time for you. Uh, I think it, you know, it's funny from, from, from this, uh, this little apartment that I was in, I could see everything that I own. All my personal belongings were within a 360 degree view.
Speaker 1 00:13:46 And I used to think, what's it gonna be like when I, when I actually move up in the world someday and, and I can't see everything I own from this, this kitchen table, but, uh, I, it was just the book number, number one, you know, they say the teacher will appear when the student is ready, Uhhuh <affirmative>, you know, I was in a situation where something had to happen or I was gonna be working forever and, and the book was just so compelling and I had never, you know, I'm going, how is it that I'm in my mid forties? And I have never heard of any of this stuff before, how come I have had heard of all these different ways of investing and all the, the advantages that alternatives in real estate have over the stock market. I mean, you know, and I run into this all the time when I talk with people and you know, you're talking with somebody and well, everyone they know is in the stock market and through a 401k, all their friends, all their family, all their coworkers.
Speaker 1 00:14:34 And then you're, the loan person comes and says, wait, they're all wrong. It's not that they're all wrong, but it's an inferior way of investing. And you're the only person in their life that has ever told them that. And, and I think, uh, one of the things that I've people have asked me about me is that I have a childlike curiosity. And so when somebody says something, it sounds too good to be true. I go, well, what if it's not too good to be true? What if it is true? And, and that has happened a number of times in my life since then and the, the opportunities and the money I would've missed out on. If I did not have that kind of outlook on life are just amazing. Yeah. Well, you know, it sounds like you were, uh, ahead of your time then that, uh, you were involved in the tiny house movement before it was actually a movement, right?
Speaker 1 00:15:21 <laugh> yeah. I was forcibly involved in the tiny house movement. So, so you're talking about, um, reward and return reward and risk tend to go hand in hand. What, what did you see as, I mean, if there were no risk, everybody'd be doing it right. Everybody would see the potential reward. Okay. I'll do it. What are some of the risks that you're seeing that, or that people believe are there at least that, uh, that you had to, to cement? Well, there's, there's risk in every, every investment with the exception of treasury bills and treasury bonds has risk mm-hmm <affirmative>, every investment has, has risk. And, um, I guess I just looked at it like, like every other investment and okay. There, there's some risk, there's some returns, uh, rewards, and you have to balance that out. Um, if I hadn't of gotten the education that I got through the classes, I think that would've been a different thing if you're, if, if you're just telling somebody that and they don't dig into the details at all, then might scare them away.
Speaker 1 00:16:31 Um, but I, today I, I go, uh, you know, I think something like 75 or 80% of the trades in the stock market are done by computers, something called high frequency trading mm-hmm <affirmative>. And when people say that the stuff that they think, the stuff I do is risky. I think, I think the stuff that you do is more risky. It's a, it's a manipulated market. And as long as the powers that be are manipulating it in your direction, that's great. What happens when they change their mind. And it goes the other way. So I, I don't know what the number is, but I can tell you that, uh, you know, my investment in the stock market is less than 5% of my asset base. Mm-hmm, <affirmative> the rest of it is all alternatives. And I, and I, and I, I don't, uh, and I have experience with various alterative investments all through the pandemic, just, uh, trucking along yeah.
Speaker 1 00:17:21 And doing what they do. So you mentioned experience, um, so you're, you, you read the book, you <laugh>, you, you make it you're, you're an enterprise and young man still, you make it to the, um, seminar are, and even with the, the broken down truck, you don't have a lot of experience or any experience in real estate. Right. Right. And, and yet you jump in, well, I, so, uh, I jump in, I'll tell you how I jumped in. So, uh, for people who have been to seminars and especially free ones, they're never free because there's always an upsell of something. Right. Mm-hmm <affirmative>. And so the first upsell was a $500 class. And then, and I, and I, and I went to that class and I took my, uh, probably 16 year old son with me at the time he was in high school. And I said, Hey, why don't you go that for him?
Speaker 1 00:18:16 <laugh> I didn't no. Right. I, I, lots of times they come in pairs. Right. So it's, you know, that's true. The $500, get you two tickets away. That's true. So I went to that, so was the free seminar. And then I signed up or the, you know, then first paid seminar and, and, uh, I took him and at the end it was like, okay, well, how would you like to buy this training package, which is gonna walk you through all these different ways of investing in real estate. There was kind of a, the first class. I don't remember what it would call, but was really about your minds set. And then there was, you know, uh, mobile home investing, single family rentals, performing in non-performing notes, wholesaling, rehabbing, creative financing. And there was just, there was like a, a dozen or so classes that came with this package mm-hmm <affirmative>, and you could take them, uh, twice, uh, over, you know, a 24, 36 month period.
Speaker 1 00:19:13 And some of 'em were held in Seattle where I was living at the time, and some of 'em were held other places. And so my son and I traveled all over the country, uh, taking these classes and, uh, I put that $15,000 on my credit card at that <laugh> difficult financial point in, in my life. Right. Uh, okay. And, um, but I can tell you as difficult, it was for me, there were some people in there that didn't have $15,000 to their name. Right. But they had 15,000 of available credit and they did it. So I don't wanna make it sound like it was this, you know, uh, yeah. I was able to do it and it was painful, but it was way more painful for some other people that were taking a huge leap of faith. Right, right. And so that education, uh, you know, you just, you get more and more confidence, uh, you know, as you're going along and learn how to do this stuff, uh, you took your son 16 years old.
Speaker 1 00:20:09 How, what was his reaction to what you were doing? Well, he, he was at the, was just like me at the time we're driving home. We're both just, you know, excited and amazed at what we're learning and, and, and stuff that we have never heard before and, uh, on the drive home. And of course, you know, he's not living with me full time anymore. And on the drive home, I said's, name's Jake, it's Jake. You can, uh, feel free to share your enthusiasm with anybody you want, but I can tell you that there are gonna be some people who are gonna reign on your parade and they might be your family members. There are gonna be a lot of people who aren't gonna support you in this. They're gonna think, cause they've never heard this before. And unlike you and I are embracing it, they're gonna reject it and say it's illegal unethical or imoral mm-hmm <affirmative> and, and that's exactly what happened, but he was undeterred <laugh>.
Speaker 1 00:21:00 Yeah. And he's a commercial real estate broker today in Seattle. So cool. What, uh, what a, what age, how did he get in to that? Uh, uh, outta high school in high school, right. He, he went to college right after college. Uh, he came out and, uh, went and he actually, uh, cold called and approached a commercial brokerage, uh, in Seattle and created an internship for himself where there wasn't one. And he's still with those guys today. Nice. So how did, uh, this affect relationships as you went along? I mean, were there, did he, did he feel that, uh, that pressure, or did you feel pressure against that against what you were doing? Um, he, he certainly did. Um, but I think it was, you know, it was easy for me, easier for me to deal with, you know, as an adult mm-hmm <affirmative>, um, and just, uh, I didn't need other people to agree with me.
Speaker 1 00:21:57 I was the guy going to the classes. Yeah. I was the guy doing the homework, doing the study, reading the add books, and everybody else was just reacting blindly with, with Frank no, you know, information or experience. Right. Okay. So you, you, you, you jump in, you jump into the tune of $15,000 on a credit card. Um, how, how, how did that investment turn out for you? It, it was a great investment. Um, you know, I've, and I've, I, you know, I've taken many classes and, you know, had some paid mentorships over the years and none, you know, not one of them was, you know, was, oh, this is an exact fit mm-hmm <affirmative> right. Some of it was some of it's learning and trying things and you go, okay, well, that's not the right path for me, you know, wholesaling isn't for me, rehabbing isn't for me, maybe notes is for me.
Speaker 1 00:22:53 And so, but when you, you know, you add 'em all together and here I am, and I, I wouldn't have gotten here, uh, you know, without that education or, or, or I would've made more, more mistakes than I did, and, you know, more money, you know, kind of causing mistakes than I did had had I not had some of that, that education. Right. So what, excuse me, what, uh, you know, I'm, I'm thinking of some of my listeners who might be saying, well, you know, that'd be great if I had $15,000 of credit card limit credit limit on my mm-hmm <affirmative> accounts. Right. Um, some of 'em may already be maxed out, but what are there options for somebody who doesn't have, I mean, what, what direction would, would you, would you say, Hey, try this direction first. Well, you know, we live in a, an amazing era and, um, there is so much free information available that wasn't available and, and I'm specifically kind of referring to podcasts.
Speaker 1 00:23:56 Mm-hmm <affirmative> you can, you got podcasts and you got YouTube. Um, you'd wanna learn how to do anything. You can find it on YouTube and are there are so many people like me, uh, giving away free education on how to do certain things mm-hmm <affirmative>. And so, uh, there, there are plenty free resources available in the podcast world. Uh, you know, in books, you can join your local real estate investment association for, you know, what, maybe it's hundreds of dollar a year and, and not tens of thousand and start networking and meeting other people. And, and maybe you'll hook up with somebody who's, who's looking for some help. Uh, I met a guy who, when I was, um, starting out at one of these, uh, real estate associations, and he was a, you know, you know, buying and flipping properties and, and doing some buy and hold things.
Speaker 1 00:24:47 And he was impressed with me. And I had, I, and he was also doing a little bit of money raising to, to get some of this stuff done. And I had something that he didn't have mm-hmm <affirmative> I had a, I had a W2 job and a good credit score <laugh> and I was, I was helpful in obtaining loans and things. Yeah, yeah. Uh, for which I said, you know, I'm bringing this value to the, a table. I should get paid something for this. And when I think it should be X, so sometimes, uh, uh, it's, it's a matter of partnering up, uh, uh, uh, there's a guy, you know, somebody at the meeting has got, uh, uh, money and not little time, and you've got some extra time and not a lot of money and you pair up with somebody and there are lots of stories of people who got started like that.
Speaker 1 00:25:27 So, uh, I would say don't let not enough money be an excuse to go get some education. So how would you, how would somebody look, look, one up locally, they, they just put in their local town and then just investment, investment, uh, group or real estate investment group. Yeah. It's usually if the short term for is R R R E I a real estate investment association, but if you search for, you know, you know, real estate investment clubs near me, you'll find them, okay. There might be a, there might even be a national directory. I'm not sure I don't have it at my fingertips. I'll I will, uh, see what I can put in the, in the show notes. So I'll look for some somehow after. Okay. I'll real burning question. Snow is, how long did it take before you couldn't see all your possession?
Speaker 1 00:26:13 <laugh> oh, it was about two years before I got moved into a, a house, you know, that was more than 920 square feet. So you you're living in, or you still have your w two and you're living and you're, you're making, starting to earn some income in real estate. Well, I would say I still had my, I, you know, I had my W2 job, you know, over time, you know, uh, certainly, I mean, the 55% was gone, but the, the cash flow starts to come back as you, uh, you know, the, the, the alimony falls off after a certain period of time mm-hmm <affirmative> as does the child support. So you're, um, you know, your you're, you get some of your cash flow back, and then yeah. Then you start plugging away at these, uh, these investments. Uh, the first one I did was when my daughter was at the end of her, uh, freshman year of college, she said, Hey, dad, I wanna move off campus next year.
Speaker 1 00:27:14 And, and I knew when she went to college, I had a very good idea that this was gonna happen. Mm-hmm <affirmative> that she was gonna wanna move off campus. And I said, well, I'll be, do are. And if I'm gonna pay somebody else's mortgage for the next three years. Right. So together she and I bought a duplex. And, um, and since it was the time of president Obama's first time home buyer credit, and she was on the deed and never owned a house before we got a $15,000, uh, check from that. And then she lived in one half Plex and rented one of the two rooms, and the other side was fully rented. And I was about a, I don't know, a hundred or 120 miles away. And so, uh, she did some of the onsite stuff up there, screening tenants, and I did some of it from remotely.
Speaker 1 00:27:56 And that worked well, you know, uh, through her college year, she got a little bit of a business experience, real life. And, uh, and we had to that for quite a few years after she graduated until for various reasons, it was just, it was time to sell. Did she use any, uh, of her experience as a land lady, uh, now, or not yet? Not yet. She went on to, um, she went on to, um, get her master's degree in, uh, psychology and shes, a fan family and marriage counselor. Um, although I, you know, and she's now just kind of getting to a, a decent earning place and yeah. And, and she's very amenable to asking me about, you know, <laugh> what to do with her extra money. Yeah. So good. Oh, good. Well, you know, if she's asking, it means she's, she, wasn't a terrible, so, right, right.
Speaker 1 00:28:47 Uh, all right. And, and then, so you, you, you, that was your first and, uh, how, how, where are you at now? I mean, that, this is, this is now six, seven years down the road from that first experience. Yeah. So I am, uh, you know, I quit my, you know, that was, uh, 2009 was when that liquidity event happened. And at, at the end of, uh, 2018, I quit my corporate job. And, uh, I'll say semi-retired, I don't like the retirement work because definition is to be taken out of service, but I don't, I don't work anymore. I never have to, if I don't want to, I, you know, get to work where doing whatever you want. E exactly. So I wrote the book and I, I, uh, do my
[email protected]. And, um, uh, that's what I like to do. And, uh, and I, I like to do road trips across the country and on one of the motorcycles or in the Corvette soon to be, uh, joined by another one.
Speaker 1 00:29:40 <laugh> so, uh, and you know, I'm still years. Can I ask what years? Yeah. The, uh, the one I have now is a 2003 six, which is the 50th anniversary of the core vet. And I have my deposit down on the new zero six, which comes out next month. So don't know yet when I'll so well, so you, are you your retire or you're, you're living on, uh, income generated from rents at this point, or I'm living, buying and selling as well? Yeah, so I am, I'm living on passive income, so I don't do anything active. So I have the managers. Yeah, yeah. I, uh, uh, so my, my income comes from a couple things. So, uh, I have a, a, I have a pension from, from my company mm-hmm <affirmative> and then, um, I did something that was recommended to be by a financial advisor, uh, kind of an, a little bit of an alternative of, uh, investment advisor.
Speaker 1 00:30:43 I went to him because he kind of spoke my language a little bit mm-hmm <affirmative>, you know, and, and, uh, the, the pension wasn't big enough to, uh, to do everything. Um, and he said, he said, Chris, you need to, um, I, he said, for example, he said, if, if you need to build a base of gay, guaranteed income, that is, that is just steady, comes in day in, day out, regardless of your investments or the marketplace. And so let's say you had a, let's say you had a hundred thousand dollars year. Those were your living expenses. He would say, you know, we need to see if we could stack up a couple of different things to maybe get you to see 70 or 80,000, uh, of guaranteed income. So I supplemented my pension by creating two other pensions mm-hmm <affirmative> by taking some 401k money and buying two annuities to stack on top of that, to create this guaranteed level of income, which just about covers my lifestyle.
Speaker 1 00:31:43 Right. And then the other income is, is from, uh, investments, passive investments, different types of syndications, self storage, ATM machines, and apartment buildings. Mm-hmm <affirmative>. And, and, uh, you know, I don't have to worry about my basic living expenses with, you know, what those, what those investments do. Some of 'em are more, uh, appreciation a assets, some of 'em more cash, but, you know, I do know people that their retirement consists of a 401k, which involves a constant, trying to figure out what I'm gonna sell this month. Mm-hmm <affirmative>, uh, you know, to pay my bills. And I think that would be a tough yeah. Tough way to go. Uh, yeah, so it becomes very, it be the, the, uh, contributions may be passive, but the trying to figure out how to take it all out can be pretty active. I, uh, yeah, and every, every, you know, every, you know, every time you take something out, it's a, it's a, it's a taxable event.
Speaker 1 00:32:42 And, and if the market goes down, well, now I gotta, and you, if your market go down and you need, and you need $10,000 a month ago, gosh, now I gotta sell, you know, 25% more shares than I would've had to sell. I would've had to sell last week just to get the same $10,000. Uh, it's just, it's just a mess. And yeah, it doesn't work for it. Doesn't work for 401k is a terrible vehicle and it doesn't work for 92% of the population. Yeah. Well, Hey, Chris, you you've mentioned, uh, you mentioned your book, what's the name of it? Uh, the name of the book is get off your ass, a dollar sign dollar site and manage your subtitle, why you need alternative investments. All right. And that came out just this LA, uh, end of 2021, right? Yeah. This, this end of yeah.
Speaker 1 00:33:28 November. Right. All right. And you, uh, you, what else are you doing now to support others in that, uh, in, in the kind of their own journeys to financial independence through alternative investments? So I have up the website, uh, the prolific investor.net, and there, uh, there's a link to the book and I have, uh, articles 45 of them, 45 consecutive months. Mm-hmm <affirmative> of articles about different aspects of personal finance and alternative investments and U, and, uh, these are all things that I have done. Nothing that's in here is something that I pulled out of a textbook I'm I'm talking about real experience, right. Uh, there's a resources page where I have podcasts and books and mastermind groups and all types of other providers that either most of them, I have used in some cases, if I haven't done that particular thing, you know, I'll say, Hey, these are two that continue to come up as highly recommended by people I know, like, and trust.
Speaker 1 00:34:23 And, um, I set aside Thursdays on my schedule for virtual coffee. So there's a little, uh, coffee cup in the middle of the page. And if anybody wants to have a free 30 minute, uh, video conference with me, those are on Thursdays. There's a link to get you to my schedule. And if you wanna talk about this stuff, love to do it. Um, I think that's, you know, that's all the stuff. And then just, you know, talking with guys like you, who are doing different things. Yeah. No, I'm good. I, I appreciate, uh, that I, that I'm all about getting on and building my own, uh, um, network of versus that I can, I, that, that speak to me, I use that speak my language and that I can, yeah, there you go. I can trust and work and reach out to, but, uh, okay. So, uh, uh, Chris, last, last question. What, uh, and, and by the way, uh, listeners, I will put all that information, uh, that, uh, Chris just shared in, in today's footnote. So make sure you check those out at the bottom of this, uh, this video, Chris, what's one practical step or piece of advice you would leave with our listeners.
Speaker 1 00:35:31 Well, I already talked a lot about education, so I think I'm gonna talk about, and, and, and the childlike curiosity mm-hmm <affirmative>. So now I gotta pick another one. Um, there's a, just from a, from a, a time management perspective. Well, there's really no such thing, cuz nobody can manage time. All we can do is manage our activities. Right? True. That's true. There's a, there's a, there's a book called the one thing and I heard the author on a podcast and I started that started changing my life before I even read the book, I got the book, but you know, he talks about how action list are just terrible. And this is a, this is something that was developed by Gary Keller. Who's one of the co-founders of Keller Keller Williams, but he would, he would get to together with his, um, his top performing agents and they would talk about on, on a weekly basis and they would talk about what they were doing.
Speaker 1 00:36:24 He said, okay, for next week you gotta do these five things. And so they would call back next week and inevitably they hadn't done those five things. They had done other five things, but they didn't do all of the five things. So anyway, he went through, it just kept, it just kept the same thing until he got down to one thing. Yep. This is the one thing. So I want you to do the one thing that is gonna make your business or your life easier. In fact, it's gonna be so good. It's gonna, it's just gonna push some other things that off your list completely D don't even need to be done. And so I I've always been a big, okay, action list. Keep track of all this stuff. But the truth is, if you think about it, at least for me, I already know what the one thing is for tomorrow.
Speaker 1 00:37:08 I've got a list, but I know what the one thing is. And so get up and start working on that one thing after you get done with that one thing, then you can start working on the one thing and, and people probably, um, don't really have to spend a whole lot of time going no to know what the one thing is. So this was a real kind of life changing thing that only happened to me within the last, uh, six months or so. Nice. Yeah. I've I've, I've heard. I don't think I've read that book yet, but uh, I've heard of it and uh, I'll back on my list and I'll, I'll put it in the, in the show notes here. There you go. Could change your life like rich dad, port did <laugh> you never know. Right, right. That one thing. Read rich dad, port dad. Yeah. <laugh> okay. Uh, Chris Ogar thank you for, uh, being my guest to date on the money fit show. I appreciate you and, um, your time with us to our listeners. Uh, thank you for joining us. Please do check out our podcast
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